Sorry to read that Antic aren't taking the Greyhound, I am really quite a fan of the Westow.
Has anyone heard any more about this other pub project they refered to?
Surely if size were the only problem the pub that closed beside the post office would be suitable?
I realise that the Dulwich woodhouse is owned by youngs, but I wonder who actually runs it? Would they be interested in expanding their portfolio??
I really hope a new pub opens, the Dolphin is the only decent pub we have currently and to be honest I don't even like it that much? I think their food is average at best and the really overcharge for it + it just doesn't seem to have a good ambience.
The community run pub is a good idea but it seems that we can not even agree amongst oursleves what kind of pub we want?
Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
The Golden LIon is nice, Friendly people, live music etc, I dont drink Beer so I have no idea about that side of it.Bazman76 wrote:Sorry to read that Antic aren't taking the Greyhound, I am really quite a fan of the Westow.
Has anyone heard any more about this other pub project they refered to?
Surely if size were the only problem the pub that closed beside the post office would be suitable?
I realise that the Dulwich woodhouse is owned by youngs, but I wonder who actually runs it? Would they be interested in expanding their portfolio??
I really hope a new pub opens, the Dolphin is the only decent pub we have currently and to be honest I don't even like it that much? I think their food is average at best and the really overcharge for it + it just doesn't seem to have a good ambience.
The community run pub is a good idea but it seems that we can not even agree amongst oursleves what kind of pub we want?
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
I should prolly give it a try.
Always thought it was for the older drinker though?
Always thought it was for the older drinker though?
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Well, that could be the case, but I dont know how old you are.Bazman76 wrote:I should prolly give it a try.
Always thought it was for the older drinker though?
I have seen say 30s in there as well, is that young?
I still feel young myself of course.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Umm well I hope 30's is still young because I'm 35!
Will give it a whirl the landlord certainly seems to make plenty of effort to have live music nights etc!
Will give it a whirl the landlord certainly seems to make plenty of effort to have live music nights etc!
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Search East
- Posts: 119
- Joined: 6 Oct 2009 20:40
- Location: Sydenham
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
If the Greyhound is pretty much being rebuilt from the ground up, then this does raise a question about what has happened to the bar interior?
The more I think about it, Antic don't build the interiors of the pubs, they repair, clean up and stylise existing elements, not worry about fitting in a new bar / pumps etc, the mechanics of a pub are all normally in place that they take over.
Is it a case that the rebuild of the Greyhound property, will have the interior in a finished shell state, available to any business to adapt and thus make it uneconomic for a bar to be built or if the previous bar still exists, have to be adapted for any internal structural changes?
The more I think about it, Antic don't build the interiors of the pubs, they repair, clean up and stylise existing elements, not worry about fitting in a new bar / pumps etc, the mechanics of a pub are all normally in place that they take over.
Is it a case that the rebuild of the Greyhound property, will have the interior in a finished shell state, available to any business to adapt and thus make it uneconomic for a bar to be built or if the previous bar still exists, have to be adapted for any internal structural changes?
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Here is the story in the SLP refered to above:
Pub pulled down without go-ahead
By John Hugill
NEIGHBOURS of a former pub are furious the protected building has been knocked down.
People in Sydenham were shocked to discover the former Greyhound pub in Kirkdale had been demolished at the end of last month – with just one wall still standing.
Over the past few months, developer Purelake has been carrying out work to build 40 flats on the site and partly redevelop the pub building.
The firm never had permission from Lewisham council to demolish the Greyhound and the community campaigned to save its boozer from the bulldozers.
In 2008, activist Liam Curran, who is now a Lewisham Labour councillor, won a campaign to have the building included in a conservation area, protecting it from demolition.
He said: “I am absolutely disgusted at what the developers have done.
“They don’t have permission for demolition, so they have just broken planning rules.
“I am demanding that they rebuild the pub brick by brick.”
Work on the site, which is due to finish later this year, was planned to include flats and a redeveloped pub.
Pub chain Antic, which runs several successful boozers across South London, had planned to take over the running of the building.
But in February it pulled out of a deal, claiming redevelopment work had left the building “too small” for use.
Sydenham Society member Tim Lund said: “It has been a shock to see the developer has systematically pulled the whole building down.”
After being contacted on Tuesday, Purelake said it would not be able to comment in time for today’s edition of the South London Press.
A council spokeswoman said: “The Greyhound pub is within the Cobbs Corner Conservation Area and requires permission for demolition.
“The council previously gave consent to allow the developers to demolish part of the building.
“However, council officers are concerned that substantially more has now been demolished.
“Officers have therefore requested an urgent structural report and explanation of why such extensive demolition has taken place while further steps are considered.”
Pub pulled down without go-ahead
By John Hugill
NEIGHBOURS of a former pub are furious the protected building has been knocked down.
People in Sydenham were shocked to discover the former Greyhound pub in Kirkdale had been demolished at the end of last month – with just one wall still standing.
Over the past few months, developer Purelake has been carrying out work to build 40 flats on the site and partly redevelop the pub building.
The firm never had permission from Lewisham council to demolish the Greyhound and the community campaigned to save its boozer from the bulldozers.
In 2008, activist Liam Curran, who is now a Lewisham Labour councillor, won a campaign to have the building included in a conservation area, protecting it from demolition.
He said: “I am absolutely disgusted at what the developers have done.
“They don’t have permission for demolition, so they have just broken planning rules.
“I am demanding that they rebuild the pub brick by brick.”
Work on the site, which is due to finish later this year, was planned to include flats and a redeveloped pub.
Pub chain Antic, which runs several successful boozers across South London, had planned to take over the running of the building.
But in February it pulled out of a deal, claiming redevelopment work had left the building “too small” for use.
Sydenham Society member Tim Lund said: “It has been a shock to see the developer has systematically pulled the whole building down.”
After being contacted on Tuesday, Purelake said it would not be able to comment in time for today’s edition of the South London Press.
A council spokeswoman said: “The Greyhound pub is within the Cobbs Corner Conservation Area and requires permission for demolition.
“The council previously gave consent to allow the developers to demolish part of the building.
“However, council officers are concerned that substantially more has now been demolished.
“Officers have therefore requested an urgent structural report and explanation of why such extensive demolition has taken place while further steps are considered.”
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Can the council force them to re-build it or will the developed just get a slap on the wrist?
I can't think the developer thought no one would notice, so I'm guessing they are quite confident that any measures the council can take will be relatively minor?
I can't think the developer thought no one would notice, so I'm guessing they are quite confident that any measures the council can take will be relatively minor?
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
As I understand it, they can. Although Purelake have yet to comment, I think they are committed to rebuilding it so it can be sold as a pub. Seeing as Purelake's business model is to develop sites for social housing, if they failed to rebuild the Greyhound they would have trouble getting permission for subsequent developments.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
I reckon they'll get a not too stern ticking off. If the developer digs its heels what council would be willing to shell out legal fees to get the damage put right?
I''ll stand by what I said before - if this building (or what's left of it) ever sees light of day as a pub I'll eat my pants.
I''ll stand by what I said before - if this building (or what's left of it) ever sees light of day as a pub I'll eat my pants.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
I think it is worth remembering that there are a few political reputations on the line here. The Mayor, Cllr Best and the now "disgusted" Cllr Liam Curran were all keen to take the credit for "saving" the Greyhound.
The finance director of Purelake is the brother of our MP.
I think it will be rebuilt. Purelake are making plenty of money out of the development and some of the costs of rebuilding will surely be clawed back if they are able to sell the pub to an operator. They were marketing it at £400,000 and I doubt it woud cost them anything like that to rebuild it.
The finance director of Purelake is the brother of our MP.
I think it will be rebuilt. Purelake are making plenty of money out of the development and some of the costs of rebuilding will surely be clawed back if they are able to sell the pub to an operator. They were marketing it at £400,000 and I doubt it woud cost them anything like that to rebuild it.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
So our MP has family connections to the devolper. I trust this has been declared.
This is an absolute disgrace . It is beyond belief the person knocking it down did not have instructions so to do.
Before it is rebuilt think will the new building be ant where near as impressive. Also we know the building is to small for most pubs etc.
Why not fine them the cost of rebuilding and donate the money to a deserving charity like St Christopher's Hospisce.
This is an absolute disgrace . It is beyond belief the person knocking it down did not have instructions so to do.
Before it is rebuilt think will the new building be ant where near as impressive. Also we know the building is to small for most pubs etc.
Why not fine them the cost of rebuilding and donate the money to a deserving charity like St Christopher's Hospisce.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Funny. The building wasn't too small for a pub before developers closed it down.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
That is a very good point.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
The old Pub had a lot of extensions so you do not get the full picture unless you knew the old building.
I am fairly certain the old Pub did not serve food which any potential owner would be looking at. After space for kitchens etc not much space.
I am fairly certain the old Pub did not serve food which any potential owner would be looking at. After space for kitchens etc not much space.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
It did sell food Eagle.
Kitchens don't need too much space (look at the Dolphin).
A lot of the old Greyhound wasn't used by the previous operators.
Kitchens don't need too much space (look at the Dolphin).
A lot of the old Greyhound wasn't used by the previous operators.
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Oh sorry. Must admit kept away from it for at least 10 years before it was closed, as seem to be frequented by some unsavoury sorts.
The Dolphin I would think is larger plus a huge garden.
Not trying to be negative but trying to be realistic . What is the point of it being rebuilt if no one prepared to lease or buy it.
It was doomed the moment the grotesque scheme for the flats was envisaged.
The Dolphin I would think is larger plus a huge garden.
Not trying to be negative but trying to be realistic . What is the point of it being rebuilt if no one prepared to lease or buy it.
It was doomed the moment the grotesque scheme for the flats was envisaged.
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blue&whitewizard1991
- Posts: 46
- Joined: 23 Jul 2008 18:32
- Location: Lawrie Park Road
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
I share people's dismay at what has happened with the Greyhound. Though I do agree with Simon that it would be political and commercial suicide if Purelake chose not to reinstate the building. Not doing so would all but ruin their chances of securing other developments in lewisham and surrounding boroughs.
My concern rests more with the buildings future use, when it is rebuilt. It simply cannot become a bookies! The space marketed by Acorn is not too small for a pub. The building has a huge cellar, large enough for a kitchen to be developed in the basement. Anyone who has been to pubs like the Draft House on Northcote Rd, the Rake, Southhampton arms (I could go on for ever) can see that the key determinant of a successful pub is not floorspace. Instead a succesful pub in this day and age, is generally 'free of tie' for some if not all products on the bar, has a landlord that is serious about offering good quality beer and has thought about complementing wet sales with a sensible food offer. All these things can easily be achieved at the Greyhound.
Antic did not pull out because the pub was too small, they pulled out because they got 'naffed off' (yorkshire colloquialism) by a developer who did not communicate and frankly was ignorant of their interests. Antic will be coming to Sydenham soon in a space that allows them to start trading far sooner than they could have, if they had hung around waiting for Purelake!
Antic have often led the regeneration of other 'under-invested' communities elsewhere, by acting as a 'first mover'. A strategy that makes economic sense on two fronts, firstly they buy into buildings at an affordable level and secondly they generate huge amounts of good will from a loyal following that welcome their investment into the area by buying lots of beer on a regular basis.
I look forward to Antic's arrival and the long-awaited street improvements and hope that this acts as a catalyst for wider regeneration of the high street.
Oh and can anyone tell me how Purelake's S106 is being used - couldn't this be used as match funding for the Portas Pilot or street improvements?
My concern rests more with the buildings future use, when it is rebuilt. It simply cannot become a bookies! The space marketed by Acorn is not too small for a pub. The building has a huge cellar, large enough for a kitchen to be developed in the basement. Anyone who has been to pubs like the Draft House on Northcote Rd, the Rake, Southhampton arms (I could go on for ever) can see that the key determinant of a successful pub is not floorspace. Instead a succesful pub in this day and age, is generally 'free of tie' for some if not all products on the bar, has a landlord that is serious about offering good quality beer and has thought about complementing wet sales with a sensible food offer. All these things can easily be achieved at the Greyhound.
Antic did not pull out because the pub was too small, they pulled out because they got 'naffed off' (yorkshire colloquialism) by a developer who did not communicate and frankly was ignorant of their interests. Antic will be coming to Sydenham soon in a space that allows them to start trading far sooner than they could have, if they had hung around waiting for Purelake!
Antic have often led the regeneration of other 'under-invested' communities elsewhere, by acting as a 'first mover'. A strategy that makes economic sense on two fronts, firstly they buy into buildings at an affordable level and secondly they generate huge amounts of good will from a loyal following that welcome their investment into the area by buying lots of beer on a regular basis.
I look forward to Antic's arrival and the long-awaited street improvements and hope that this acts as a catalyst for wider regeneration of the high street.
Oh and can anyone tell me how Purelake's S106 is being used - couldn't this be used as match funding for the Portas Pilot or street improvements?
Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Well said wizard!
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Re: Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound
Couldn't have put it better Whitoff. Great to hear some positivity from some peeps!Whiftoff wrote:Well said wizard
G-Man
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