How to avoid Tesco, Sydenham Road

[JRobinson]

I hate being smug (no really I do) - but Rod Taylor said that McDonalds are not oppening new shops, and you HB came back with a snide remark, and a link to an article in the Guardian, and said that McDonalds is booming.

Well I went and read the article, and although it states that they (McDonalds) are creating 2500 new jobs - nowhere does it say that they are oppening new stores. In fact, I went back and re-read the article just to make sure that my point is valid. It doesn't mention any new store, just that they've employed 20,000 more people, over the past 5 years, and 2500 this year.

they might be booming, but that's beside the point of the statement - the linked article does not prove either way if they are or are not oppening new stores.

[hairybuddha]

Are you going to attempt a defence of your earlier comments about support for your campaign or are you just going to park that?

Rod's comments were about the lack of growth and eventual decline of large businesses. He implied that they were no longer opening new stores and their rise was no longer "assured". Well that's nonsense. As a very quick scan of the internet will show. McDonalds is opening 1200 new stores every year, 30 in the UK. It's sales continue to grow and it is creating jobs and investing in local communities. Just like Tesco.

[CaptainCarCrash]

The problem with a Tesco opening in Sydenham has nowt to do with cardboard flavoured produce. It's about damaging the community and the high street as a whole.

A lot of work has been done to try and promote indi stuff but the only problem is the competition and the demographics. Rod doesn't like chains he spends a lot of time decrying chains with money that have and are causing some to recoil in disgust at the direction our "I want it now" society is taking.

Although some are doing well the truth is price V's convenience and other factors.
A lot of places seem to be populated by bookies, money shops, chicken shops, and take-away's.
The truth is there just aren't enough yuppies interested in Sydenham high street.

[Mangetout]

If you don't like Tesco, don't go there - simple. For my own part, as someone who has lived in Sydenham for over ten years, and shops locally, Tesco is more than welcome. It'll improve one of the worst eyesores in the High st, rids us of the offending apostrophe, and even if it takes some trade from neighbouring grocery shops, it'll never compete with PFC for range, or Coop for it's friendly staff. You never know, even the town tramps may be encouraged to loiter elsewhere.

Sydenham is not Dulwich. Indi's are all well and good but Tesco is a darn sight better than a derelict pub.

[hairybuddha]

If you don't like Tesco, don't go there - simple. For my own part, as someone who has lived in Sydenham for over ten years, and shops locally, Tesco is more than welcome. It'll improve one of the worst eyesores in the High st, rids us of the offending apostrophe, and even if it takes some trade from neighbouring grocery shops, it'll never compete with PFC for range, or Coop for it's friendly staff. You never know, even the town tramps may be encouraged to loiter elsewhere.

Sydenham is not Dulwich. Indi's are all well and good but Tesco is a darn sight better than a derelict pub.

make that 14 v 8

[maestro]

You never know, even the town tramps may be encouraged to loiter elsewhere.

I'm sure they'll quickly establish themselves in the new 'Pocket Park' and claim the area as their exclusive territory.

[14BradfordRoad]

If you don't like Tesco, don't go there - simple. For my own part, as someone who has lived in Sydenham for over ten years, and shops locally, Tesco is more than welcome. It'll improve one of the worst eyesores in the High st, rids us of the offending apostrophe, and even if it takes some trade from neighbouring grocery shops, it'll never compete with PFC for range, or Coop for it's friendly staff. You never know, even the town tramps may be encouraged to loiter elsewhere.

Sydenham is not Dulwich. Indi's are all well and good but Tesco is a darn sight better than a derelict pub.

make that 14 v 8

What next: A Pro Tesco thread?

[hairybuddha]

Now, now. Wouldn't want to get tarred and feathered at the meet up

[Eagle]

I would imagine the drunken tramps cannot wait for the pocket park Maestro.

I wonder if they will patronise Tesco for their essentials.

[maestro]

I wonder if they will patronise Tesco for their essentials.

It'll certainly provide more choice as to where they can do their shoplifting (unless they all decide to boycott it on ethical grounds).

[syd]

I admit when I saw this thread I thought it was a waste of time. I went to tesco yesterday. The soap was smaller but more expensive and the eggs were not large but mixed and more expensive than Abel and cole. There is also sugar in everything. I will never go back I can't understand why they are so popular.

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[michael]

Here is my view of Hubbub, posted on South East Central in May last year:

My problem is that I don't have a local greengrocer, butcher, or fishmonger. I would love to see one where I live so that I can support the local economy and encourage more businesses to open up in the empty units around the town centre. Shopping in East Dulwich or Waterloo does nothing to help any shops where I live, whether I go there in person or get deliveries online.

I happen to work in Waterloo, a 45 minute journey by train from my home, so when businesses there are described as 'local' to my home I start to question the definition of local.

My concern is that as more people choose to shop online (through any provider; multi-national, partnership, or independent shops) it reduces the chance of my local high street becoming as vibrant as it should be. With leafleting directly targeting my local area this is a good opportunity for non-local businesses to grab a piece of the market without a physical presence in the area. This entrenches independent shops in highly desirable areas, while the majority of town centres go without such choice.

Every time I visit these fine shops online or in person I know that I am decreasing the chance of them visiting me and helping to improve my town centre and my regular shopping experience. My message to independent shops that want my custom is to open up a branch near me. I'm sure that comes across as a very bitter and IMBY attitude - sorry.

[louisecbrooks]

Loving the idea of Hubbub. I've just dropped them an email to find out how local independent can apply to be added to their list of suppliers. I noticed Franklins from ED and Hills and Parkes from Honor Oak Park on there. A facility like this that is a popular portal is a great way for independents to boost their income online and therefore not have to solely rely on their high street position (a seriously vulnerable place at the moment I think you'll agree). I wonder if there's any mileage in setting up a SEE3/local model of this kind could work as an alternative to carrying out online shops with the larger supermarkets.

With regard to the Two Halves although I'm loathe to see Tesco take such a prominent space on the high street that could be home to a great pub or restaurant, the high price tag of £50k/an in rent is going to be a serious deterrent for other potential businesses that might better meet with the aspirations and needs of the community.

[leenewham]

I think this is a great initiative Rod.

[michael]

If Hubbub serves well the artisan stores of Lordship Lane, it would also, logic dictates, provide a service for Sydenham Road where, not least, retail rental space is cheaper.

It is a big risk for any shop to expand beyond their first or second shop, it is a tiny risk to open you 5,000th shop.
Online deliveries help existing shops (often focused in small areas with high disposal income) to reach a wider audience. Logic dictate that if this online business model is successful their inclination to open physical shops in areas with lower disposable income will be reduced.

And if people are getting deliveries from Hubbub for some purchases they are more likely to get a variety of goods online, that isn't going to help smaller or new independent shops outside of the scheme - like Billings, The Butchery, IBS, Aga's Deli, Well Being, etc. It possibly creates an even greater barrier to entry for new shops on our high streets.

The principle is a good one. The execution is excellent. But I worry about the unintended consequences.

[leenewham]

I agree, but unless high streets can compete on convenience with online, I think they may struggle. I don't think they have much of a choice in the long term. But it will only work if high streets work together. Small shops should, in theory be able to adapt and change more than larger brands, but in practice they don't. This unwillingness to change is partly why high streets are struggling.

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[Tim Lund]

This earlier posting, "The solution for High Streets like Sydenham" is relevant here. For the removal of any doubt, when I wrote:

We need a national - or maybe better London-wide - commercial freehold reform - in which existing commercial landlords are offered a deal which will leave both them and High Streets such as Sydenham Road better off. The value added would come from consolidating holdings geographically, so that we also had landlords who could invest as do the Grosvenor and Howard de Walden estates.

it was more to make the point about how difficult it is for High Streets such as Sydenham, rather than as something which I think could happen.