Conservation area query

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wen
Posts: 34
Joined: 17 Jan 2014 09:27

Conservation area query

Post by wen »

So, I'm now the owner of a semi detached 1930s flat on kirkdale, which I lovingly refer to as a bomb site as it needs work :lol:

Part of the works would be replacing the windows - front windows facing the street have cheap aluminium double glazing that have blown and are not safety compliant (big pane of glass in bay window does not open). Windows in back are lovely single glazed windows, but again not safety compliant.

Does anyone know or have experience of what kind of windows will be acceptable for a 1930s flat in the cobb's corner conservation area? I've tried looking at similar flats around, but all have upvc as quite recent conservation area. Any recommendations for architects, if needed, would be great, as well as window fitters!
marymck
Posts: 1579
Joined: 9 Feb 2008 16:30
Location: Upper Kirkdale

Re: Conservation area query

Post by marymck »

Congratulations on your new home, Wen. I hope you'll be very happy.

I believe that for a house of that age it would need to be aluminium or wood. Lewisham's conservation officers could tell you more. In a conservation area you need planning permission.

But building regs aren't retrospective. You don't have to meet current building regs if for example your windows date to the 1960s. So you don't have to replace your windows till you want to.

But obviously when you are ready to do so you need to be confident that the new windows meet not only building regs , but conservation area requirements. And you submit details of the windows on the planning application, so you can be confident of no problems once it's approved.

I can highly recommend a company called Heritage Windows. I will find their card and post on here. They do lots of types of windows including those Critall windows, but modern regs compliant.

I would be a bit wary of some window installers. So you're quite right to find out for yourself. For instance, there's a window shop on the Kirkdale/Dartmouth Road junction and not long after they opened I went in and asked them if they did windows suitable for our local conservation area. They said they'd do whatever the customer asked for. Conservation area the customer's responsibility. When I said I didn't think that very helpful, because if they installed windows that weren't conservation area compliant the Council could insist they get replaced, the guy behind the counter shrugged and told me frankly customer's responsibility and customer's problem.
JT123
Posts: 12
Joined: 21 Jun 2012 13:45
Location: SE26

Re: Conservation area query

Post by JT123 »

Hi, I suspect I live in a similar flat (part of the Collingtree development) and replaced my windows last year. I was advised by the Council that I needed planning permission because the flat was part of a larger building in multiple occupation but not a single company that I had round to quote mentioned this and I suspect most home owners don't bother. However I dutifully went through the process - the conservation stuff was really about how the building looks, fits in with the street, access requirements - all a bit surpufulous for a private 1930s building in a street full of same all with non-original windows. On a more positive note the Council didn't seem too bothered about the fitting of 'bog-standard' UPVC windows to replace the dated aluminium double glazing.
wen
Posts: 34
Joined: 17 Jan 2014 09:27

Re: Conservation area query

Post by wen »

marymck - thank you, I'm getting loads of good vibes so far the few times I've been in Sydenham to start sorting out work on the flat. It does help that I've already met two of my neighbours, and they seem lovely and welcoming :) That'll be a change, knowing more than 1 of my neighbours!

I have contacted Lewisham planning information service via email for further guidance, but thought someone on this forum might know what to do. Thank you for clarifying about the building regs. Would Heritage Windows be this one? http://www.theheritagewindowcompany.co.uk/ If not, please let me have their details.

I'm wary of most changes to old building to be fair - a colleague today told me he thought I'd get rid of the chimney, to my utter horror. Same reaction when a builder suggested getting rid of the picture rail!

JT123 - yes, our flat will definitely be similar, as I'm slightly further down the road towards the kirkdale shops. I suspect a lot of individual home owners don't bother with the planning process, but it will annoy me if I don't go through the required process. It's a relief that they accepted upvc. As much as I like wood, I don't think I can stretch my budget to that. Did you hire anyone to help you through the planning permission process, or can it be done by ourselves? And if you don't mind, could you also let me know who you used for the window fitting etc? Please PM me if you don't want to post this info online. Thank you :)
JT123
Posts: 12
Joined: 21 Jun 2012 13:45
Location: SE26

Re: Conservation area query

Post by JT123 »

I did the application myself - I don't think you need to hire anyone but I would recommend speaking to someone at the Council before completeing the forms about exactly what they need. The officers I spoke to were helpful but the forms really aren't aimed at this type of work so it can be difficult trying to work out which parts to fill in and what infromation is required. Any mistakes will mean the forms are sent back and the process is delayed (I know to my cost). I used Crestshield who weren't the cheapest quote I got (nor the most expensive) but they did the job well- no complaints. I probably have a copy of the planning application I did so if you want to have a look PM me and I'll get you a copy.
marymck
Posts: 1579
Joined: 9 Feb 2008 16:30
Location: Upper Kirkdale

Re: Conservation area query

Post by marymck »

#I hate Purelake too. They destroyed Sydenham's Greyhound. This to get it trending! (I'm too old to use this language lol)

Yes, Wen it is that Heritage Window Company. I highly recommend them.
Rachael
Posts: 2450
Joined: 23 Jan 2010 13:42
Location: Sydenham / Forest Hill Intersection

Re: Conservation area query

Post by Rachael »

#IHatePurelake - you have to do it like this, Mary, with no spaces.

Sorry to butt in.
marymck
Posts: 1579
Joined: 9 Feb 2008 16:30
Location: Upper Kirkdale

Re: Conservation area query

Post by marymck »

#IHatePurelake

Thanks Rachael. :lol:
wen
Posts: 34
Joined: 17 Jan 2014 09:27

Re: Conservation area query

Post by wen »

#Ihatepurelake and the state in which they've left the Greyhound in Sydenham. What's the point of conservation area if this is allowed??

Thanks for the confirmation marymck.

JT123, thanks for the details, ideally would want to do this myself instead of paying yet someone else! I'll contact you by PM :)
Juwlz
Posts: 749
Joined: 26 Oct 2005 20:49
Location: Outer Sydenham

Re: Conservation area query

Post by Juwlz »

Anyone thinking of replacing windows on a 30s house – please consider steel windows! The original windows on many 30s houses were steel Crittal windows.

These days they are rust proof and come in single or double-glazed, and look fantastic, and also prevent burglaries because they are so strong.

There are very few companies that do them but here are two:


Lightfoot windows: http://lightfootwindows.co.uk/


Clement windows: http://www.clementwindows.co.uk/
stuart
Posts: 3422
Joined: 21 Sep 2004 10:13
Location: Lawrie Park
Contact:

Re: Conservation area query

Post by stuart »

Hi Juwlz - long time no post. Are you back in Sydenham?

Your post would have upset my dad. Crittall windows were rubbish giving the industry a bad name. Hope Windows (from Henry Hope & Sons) were the real thing and there were rather more of them. That's because we kept the best steel in the Black Country - goodness knows where those Essex bumpkins found theirs. It might have been from the stuff Vauxhall wouldn't put in their Vauxhall Victors.

Henry Hopes also had a jolly useful car park if you were going to The Hawthorns. Salad days indeed ... when curved window panes were real style hangover from the 20's.

Stuart
Juwlz
Posts: 749
Joined: 26 Oct 2005 20:49
Location: Outer Sydenham

Re: Conservation area query

Post by Juwlz »

Hi Stuart!

No, I'm not back, sadly, but I never properly leave Sydenham it seems – I still help out with the Syd Soc News from afar, and occasionally I'm in the neighbourhood. I like to check out the forum now and again, just bein nosy!

That's very interesting about the Henry Hope windows, I have only ever heard of Crittall.

I got a bit obsessed about steel windows when I was getting ours replaced and there was very little information available anywhere, even on the internet, so I can never resist giving a bit of advice on them when the opportunity arises!

I think you can get decent aluminium ones too these days. This link shows how hideous UPVC replacements can ruin a house, and some nice aluminium alternatives: http://www.aluminiumtradesupply.co.uk/6 ... with-upvc/


Juwlz
mosy
Posts: 4103
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 20:28
Location: London

Re: Conservation area query

Post by mosy »

Some replacement windows I got for the front of a 30's house I owned were hardwood surround and (white) metal for the glass support frame bit, with some leading in between the double glazing for the small top-opening windows.

UPVC is not only very clumpy - it has to be for the requisite strength - but also is subject to pitting (=embedded muck) from acid rain. I did have those at the back though, being cheaper.
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