Gourmet Burger Kitchen for Sydenham

Trawlerman · Post by **Trawlerman** » 3 Jan 2010 22:17

I was weaned on pie and mash!

There's a pretty decent shop in Sutton. Roman Road in the East End has several. East Street has one and I believe there are a couple in Bermondsy.
The one in Sydenham seemed to lack a certain authenticity

Ulysses · Post by **Ulysses** » 4 Jan 2010 12:52

Trawlerman wrote:I was weaned on pie and mash!

There's a pretty decent shop in Sutton. Roman Road in the East End has several. East Street has one and I believe there are a couple in Bermondsy.
The one in Sydenham seemed to lack a certain authenticity

I wonder how a pie and mash shop would fare [pun intended] to be honest Trawlerman. My only frame of reference here was a fairly frequent visitor to the one in West Greenwich (near to the Cutty Sark). Aswell as the proper East End geezers who would cross the foot tunnel to eat there you had the throngs of tourists...

Despite this, it shut down.

If Greenwich cannot sustain one even with these advantages then what hope does dear old Sydders have?.

Trawlerman · Post by **Trawlerman** » 4 Jan 2010 13:52

Ulysses, sad to say...You probably have point.
There is another decent venue in Eltham...But, they also do bangers 'n mash etc. Luckily, their proper pie 'n mash hasn't suffered [it's still pretty authentic]

I know I've been banging on a bit but I think we may be ripe for a return to a bit of 'authenticity' . They're ok...But I a bit fed up with yer 'subs' , Mc Ds and various 'posh burger' joints!

Ulysses · Post by **Ulysses** » 4 Jan 2010 23:38

I understand your point Trawlerman. I'm certainly not anti pie 'n' mash as I used to go to the one in Greenwich alot. I just wonder what demand there is for it in todays palate. We've enjoyed a bit of a return to 'authentic' cooking with the resurgence of the type of food in Delia's/Nigella's and even Jamie's cook books but jellied eels remain something of a bookmark in history. I haven't seen it on too many restaurant/gastropub menus alongside spotted dick et al.

Which is a shame.

Depsite this I don't think Goddard's in Greenwich went south due to lack of custom. It was always chock-full, especially with Japanese tourists wanting some real London food. I think they got too good an offer and sold up. Funnily enough, if memory serves, Goddard's is now a GBK in Greenwich.

I thought this was an interesting article which touched on the loss of Pie'n'Mash going hand in hand with the loss of true cockneys:

http://www.timeout.com/london/big-smoke ... leAfterMpu

Ulysses · Post by **Ulysses** » 5 Jan 2010 00:01

Wondered if anyone has read Ackroyd's London: A Biography. It's been sitting on a shelf for ages...

lambchops · Post by **lambchops** » 5 Jan 2010 01:29

I seem to remember that Goddards closed because the owner (or someone crucial to the business) got sick and they had to close...i could be wrong, but I think there was a sign up in thier window just before they closed.

Juwlz · Post by **Juwlz** » 5 Jan 2010 11:34

Ulysses wrote:I understand your point Trawlerman. I'm certainly not anti pie 'n' mash as I used to go to the one in Greenwich alot. I just wonder what demand there is for it in todays palate. We've enjoyed a bit of a return to 'authentic' cooking with the resurgence of the type of food in Delia's/Nigella's and even Jamie's cook books but jellied eels remain something of a bookmark in history. I haven't seen it on too many restaurant/gastropub menus alongside spotted dick et al.

Which is a shame.

Depsite this I don't think Goddard's in Greenwich went south due to lack of custom. It was always chock-full, especially with Japanese tourists wanting some real London food. I think they got too good an offer and sold up. Funnily enough, if memory serves, Goddard's is now a GBK in Greenwich.

I thought this was an interesting article which touched on the loss of Pie'n'Mash going hand in hand with the loss of true cockneys:

http://www.timeout.com/london/big-smoke ... leAfterMpu

I used to go to Goddard's after visiting the auction (and if you want to see a true cockney or two go to the auction!) and was gobsmacked when I saw it had turned into a Gourmet burger place. I went in despite my reservations and it was packed out with middle class people and their giant buggies. I'm middle class myself but I feel a little bit ill if I have to be in the same room as too many of us for a long time so I ordered a takeaway.

Half-an-hour it took for them to make it. You used to get the pie and mash straight away.
The burger tasted okay but nearly bankrupted me and that was the last time I went there.

Trawlerman · Post by **Trawlerman** » 5 Jan 2010 14:19

Gawd Blimey, guv. Strike a light! [etc]...I do believe things may begin to look up. Perhaps the time has come for a real renaissance in proper English cooking!

Re Ackroyd's 'London'...Great book, and excellent read. Recommended without reservation.

Julsb · Post by **Julsb** » 6 Jan 2010 09:50

Terribly sorry to hear that we white collar families very young children make you ill, Juwlz. We always speak so well of you.

I love the idea of pie & mash. Unfortunately, I've found the actual execution of it pretty bad. Those who are still in business seem happy to lure in the nostalgics at the expense of people who like to, y'know, enjoy the food they've just paid for.

Ulysses · Post by **Ulysses** » 6 Jan 2010 12:23

Regarding Goddard's: They are still trading but as a booth near the outdoor market, next to the Pizza Express.

http://www.pieshop.co.uk/2009/11/visit- ... greenwich/

I'm sure Julwz can speak for his/herself Julsb but I am not sure he/she meant it personally or in a negative way. I have noticed the increasing numbers of middle-classes and yummy-mummys in Sydders and I am never sure how to react. Perhaps it's middle-class angst or guilt but I hate seeing how effected people like myself are. It's not that we're intentionally rude, it's just that no-one else matters! Hence they block up the aisles or sit all day in the best seats nursing one coffee!

I sort of got away from these people when I left Greenwich. I have nothing against these people but I am not sure how much I like being increasingly deluged with them as they move into/come 'out' in Sydders! I might have to move to Penge/Catford or one of these many, many rough, edgy and dangerous places north of the river. I should be safe enough there?

Juwlz · Post by **Juwlz** » 6 Jan 2010 13:39

Julsb wrote:Terribly sorry to hear that we white collar families very young children make you ill, Juwlz. We always speak so well of you.

If you will take me seriously then you will take offence!

Ulysses is pretty much saying what I meant.

Julsb · Post by **Julsb** » 6 Jan 2010 15:21

Oh I see - it's those OTHER middle class people who are ghastly. Especially the ones who've turned up in the neighbourhood recently. But you've just enough salt of the earth to be all right.

leenewham · Post by **leenewham** » 6 Jan 2010 16:10

THIS IS SHEER CLASS:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0DUsGSMwZY

Are you a ronnie c, a ronnie b or a Basil?

Ulysses · Post by **Ulysses** » 6 Jan 2010 16:45

Julsb wrote:Oh I see - it's those OTHER middle class people who are ghastly. Especially the ones who've turned up in the neighbourhood recently. But you've just enough salt of the earth to be all right.

Who, or what, is he on about? I cannot make sense of this confused and confusing post.

Anyway, as for middle-class, a correspondent on Radio4 surmised middle-class as "anyone who gets out of the bath to have a wee".

It made me chuckle.

Juwlz · Post by **Juwlz** » 6 Jan 2010 17:21

Julsb wrote:Oh I see - it's those OTHER middle class people who are ghastly. Especially the ones who've turned up in the neighbourhood recently. But you've just enough salt of the earth to be all right.

Well I was talking about the Gourmet Burger place in Greenwich, I never mentioned Sydenham. I'd be quite happy if there were more middle-class people apparent in Sydenham.

Since I am a middle class person I am allowed to take the piss out of myself if I want to. Lord knows everyone else takes the p out of the middle classes, I might as well join in. And if I had a kid I'm sure I'd have a big buggy too and be proud of it.

Trawlerman · Post by **Trawlerman** » 6 Jan 2010 20:30

I take all this class business with a pinch of seal salt and a table spoon of balsamic vinegar, old bean! Pip-pip, guv!

Juwlz · Post by **Juwlz** » 6 Jan 2010 21:28

Trawlerman wrote:I take all this class business with a pinch of seal salt and a table spoon of balsamic vinegar, old bean! Pip-pip, guv!

Wow, seal salt. Is that something even more posh than sea salt? I must rush get to East Dulwich and get me some!

lambchops · Post by **lambchops** » 6 Jan 2010 21:48

I do hope it is not baby seal salt you will be buying.

Trawlerman · Post by **Trawlerman** » 6 Jan 2010 22:25

What an excellent fraudian shlip!! It was definitely subcutaneous. See, we can have a larf in Sydene-HAM!! Or at least a bit of a grin.
[And it doesn't cost a groat or even a goat.]

Juwlz · Post by **Juwlz** » 6 Jan 2010 22:59

lambchops wrote:I do hope it is not baby seal salt you will be buying.

Apparently there's a club for everyone wanting to buy some of that.

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Gourmet Burger Kitchen for Sydenham