Old Floor Zone shop let

[G-Man]

Be interesting how they do the inside and what the food is like. Would personally like it if they also served some decent Craft Beer. The Dolphin has started serving a few which is great!

G-Man

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[Chris Best]

I understand that the landlord is not prepared to allow a change of use from A1 retail - discussions are taking place with the existing lessee for a reopening which I think will enhance the diversification of shops in the high street. I hope an agreement can be reached.

[G-Man]

I guess that means the rumours are wrong then? From the Feedback on Floorzone from this thread I can't see them returning. Either way, what a shame. Thought the juice and cocktail bar sounded excellent.

G-Man

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[leenewham]

I heard it was Lewisham Council that were dragging their feet on the change of use (source: from some people who wanted to take over the lease).

Any further clarification on this Chris?

[Tim Lund]

I understand that the landlord is not prepared to allow a change of use from A1 retail - discussions are taking place with the existing lessee for a reopening which I think will enhance the diversification of shops in the high street. I hope an agreement can be reached.

Seriously - how likely is it that a landlord would not be prepared to allow a change of use? If there's a potential new tenant who's ready to pay them some rent, that the previous tenant was not, why should they ever try to stop it?

Also - how can a reopening with the existing lessee - which sounds like a reversion to the status quo - enhance diversification?

From various posts, both recent and now receeding into the past,

xxx has not received a planning application and will follow up with enforcement action following the removal of the orginal shop front without planning permission in a Conservation area. xxx is arranging a meeting with legal. Cllr Best continues to chase.

readers of this Forum will know that I think Chris Best has little understanding of the economics of the High Street, and is in fact more a hinderance than a help to the regeneration of Sydenham.

"Why we can't be like Lordship Lane" used to be a perennial favourite on these Forums, but more recently it has become why Forest Hill seems to be on the up in a way that Sydenham isn't. I think one factor is the Forest Hill Society, which is more dynamic than the older Sydenham Society, but another is that for some years it has only had Lib Dem councillors, so with little clout in the Council, and not in a position to 'continue to chase' any particular bugbears they have.

[G-Man]

I also don't understand why the landlord would not accept change of usage. Such a shame as it appears a great addition to actually help diversify the high street has been pushed out - I don't really think Floorzone returning will help, considering the feedback on this thread. Why the council can't act on this I don't know. But I don't know the ins and outs of these procedures.

Madness...considering the Protas win and the fact that so many people want posiitve things on the high street, but it appears they are being stopped by some external force, or farce.

[Weeble]

Perhaps the landlord owns or rents residential flats above the shop and is concerned about noise/odour/disruption from bar/restaurant use? Just speculating.

[Rachael]

Has anyone seen a business close down then return to the same site and open up again? Seems really odd to me.

[Chris Best]

The situation, as I understand it, is that the lessee signed a 15 year lease and there is still some four years left to run. The landlords are still receiving their rent and will grant an assignment of the existing lease but do not wish the present lessee to surrender the lease. If they accepted a surrender without a new lessee they would be down on their expected income. I also understand that the lease is quite specific in permitted use connected to flooring and furniture. So I think negotiations are ongoing for a similar reopening but with as much variety as the existing lease permits - hence my comment on diversification. Yes there are tenants living above the shops which may be a reason why the landlord is keen to keep control over the usage. I know when I managed commercial property with housing above I would not allow late night use, cooking odours, musical or anything with noise etc

When this unit was advertised by Hunters the rent asked was £1,500 per month - £18,000 per annum - so rent of some £350 a week. From the Valuations Office Business Rate web site the RV is £15,500 per annum with a floor space of 85.14 sq metres - valuation is on Floor Description Area m2/unit £ m2/unit Value

1 Ground Retail Zone A 70.05 £200.00 £14,010
2 Ground Retail Zone B 15.09 £100.00 £1,509

Total area: 85.14 Subtotal: £15,519
Total value: £15,519
Rateable value: £ 15,500
The notional rates liability for 2012/13 is estimated to be £6,975.00 - so nearly £135 a week.

This gives you a minimum of £500 a week to open the shop doors.

Lewisham Council is offering a small business rate relief - for 2012/13 the relief is available at 100% for eligible properties up to £6,000 rateable value and relief decreases at a rate of around 2% per hundred pounds of rateable valueup to 0% at £12,000. Unfortunately this unit is over the qualification but there are smaller shops that could benefit.

I have been talking to the agents in the high street with a view to getting the vacant shops in short term use as a pop-up as part of the Portas pilot - and quite soon with Christmas approaching. Most of them are under offer - we are working on a community hub in one of the vacant shops that I hope will be on stream very soon.

[Rachael]

Thanks for that information, Chris. It makes the situation clearer.

[Tim Lund]

Thanks Chris - that does make more sense. In a nutshell, it's nothing to do with the landlord not allowing a change of use from A1 retail, but them wanting to get their pound of flesh out of the normal sort of lease with upward only rent reviews. Are you able to say how many years there are to run on other such leases in Sydenham Road? I believe it was a reason the old HSBC stayed vacant for so long.

[leenewham]

This highlights the need for a shake up of how leases work for high streets and how landlords deal with them. Looks like Sydenham will lose out to Forest Hill yet again in getting different, exciting businesses and supporting potential contributers to tax, GDP, growth and the local economy because a shop HAS to be selling flooring.

Unless we get some exciting new businesses (not the same old same old) into the high street within 6 months of the road improvements, Sydenham will not change, the improvements will become normal and no-one will really notice anything has changed.

A bit like Walworth.

Utterly daft.